Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

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martianRocks
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Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#1 Post by martianRocks »

I've had a few issues caused by Oracles VirtualBox Guest Additions being embedded in the MX 17.1 release WHEN it is installed as my systems host OS and this type of install IS NOT supported by Oracle. MX works fine running in a VM IF the host system is clean but with the GA embedded in the host, VBox loses control. There are also display issues that get cleaned up such as window redraws with the GA removed from the host and the proper path to user devices is restored. For me to go into explicit details, I would have to recreate and record everything and I don't want to do that becuse that would reveal that Linux IS the World of Warcraft! (and I have many other things to do!)

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richb
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#2 Post by richb »

For the sake of data collection, Is anyone else experiencing problems with VBox and Guest Additions in mX 17? Personally I am not on two machines.
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dolphin_oracle
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#3 Post by dolphin_oracle »

richb wrote:For the sake of data collection, Is anyone else experiencing problems with VBox and Guest Additions in mX 17? Personally I am not on two machines.
don't know, but we do have a few mysteries out there.
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FYI: mx "test" repo is not the same thing as debian testing repo.

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Stevo
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#4 Post by Stevo »

No problems here, either. Martian, if you wish to help us deal with your problems, you must provide more details, and be specific and complete in your answers. For example, what exactly did you do to try and remove the "Vbox GA" from the MX 17.1 that you installed on bare metal?

We will have to ignore you if you say it's too much trouble for you to do so, since nobody but you has any complaints about them...plus the WOW comment raises eyebrows.

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timkb4cq
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#5 Post by timkb4cq »

I run MX VMs for package building, along with a Windows VM for taxes, and frequently try out other distro isos in VirtualBox in MX with the guest additions installed. I don't see any display issues or Vbox "losing control".
I'm not saying you are not seeing them - it's just without specifics we have no way of tracking down why you're seeing them. We can't fix what we can't reproduce.
You're asking us to remove a feature we find valuable without any details about the problems you're seeing. We need more info.
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martianRocks
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#6 Post by martianRocks »

What part of "this type of install IS NOT supported by Oracle" don't any of you understand?? I didn't join this forum to fight you guys. My first post was about Synaptic NOT adding a CDROM to the repo (viewtopic.php?f=92&t=44505&p=440221#p440221) which seems to be caused by one of the Dev Teams tweaks, I just can't pinpoint yet. Then there's this display issue (viewtopic.php?f=97&t=44560&p=440650#p440650) that hasn't been solved by any one of you either but it cleared right up for me when I uninstalled the GA and I haven't had ANY problems since on my desktop nor in my 16th build of my 32bit Debian 9.4 VBox since. And there's a whole forum of faults piling up here. While I was building Debian, it wanted to jump OUT of the box, so I made a 32bit VBox of MX and that's when I found out GA was already installed, (shoulda read the packing.lst first) which means, THIS DISTRO SHOULD ONLY BE RUN IN A VIRTUAL MACHINE.

I like you guys, but I'm going to have to quit this forum and all future support. I like the tools you guys made. I'm not uninstalling MX but I'm not upgrading either. My install works now. It makes a real nice platform for me to accomplish my work on. Bye y'all, Thanks

[Update 25Mar]
I have completely removed MX from my hardware because of security issues. In my opinion, you guys have failed Warren Woodford by releasing this distro and if it wasn't for him, I would have never installed Linux for my desktop. I won't be back untill you can prove otherwise.
Last edited by martianRocks on Sun Mar 25, 2018 12:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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asqwerth
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#7 Post by asqwerth »

I multiboot many distros, meaning I have tested many distros' isos in Virtualbox, and I have also tested the installation/usage of Virtualbox in many different distros as the Host.

Some distros other than MX which I have used as VB Host:

1. Manjaro - works very well. Has GA preinstalled as well.
2. Korora (Fedora) - works ok, at least with the VMs I've tried. No idea if GA is preinstalled.
3. KDE Neon - runs ok. I don't think GA is preinstalled.
4. Opensuse - doesn't work very well, seems to have more problems than most rebuilding modules after kernel upgrades. Problem installing the extension pack and mounting GA "disk". Resizing VM windows are thus a problem unless the guest iso has it preinstalled.
5. Slackel (slackware current) - I've only been able to install VB with the .run file from Oracle's download page. Problem installing extension pack and mounting GA "disk".

I've run various guest distros inside MX as host: Mint 18, antiX, MX, Manjaro, Calculate Linux, Tumbleweed, popOS.

I can only say that MX works very well for me as a VB Host. Whether or not that is because GA is preinstalled in MX, I have no idea. Similarly, Manjaro with preinstalled GA works fine for me as the VB Host.

Note that I can run a Manjaro guest inside MX as Host, without issues. And surely Manjaro's packages are more leading edge than MX, being a rolling Arch-based distro.

I admit I'm very puzzled by your problems with MX's preinstalled GA. Was it because you tried to mount the GA "disk" for the Guest distro VM despite MX already having it? For me, if a guest VM's window resizes nicely in the Host distro, I would not consider mounting the GA "disk".
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BitJam
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#8 Post by BitJam »

In one of the other threads you pointed to you said:
martianRocks wrote: I used GDebi to install VBox ...
Everyone else uses the MX package installer (I think). Maybe the version of Virtual Box you are using is not the same one everyone else is using and this is why you had a problem with it that no one else had.

Most of the time when only one person has an issue and many many others don't have that issue it is because that one person did things differently than the others. Often they do it the "hard way" because they don't know about the easier way which is so obvious to us we don't imagine you were doing things differently. This is why it is a lot easier for everyone if a newbie assumes they are the ones who are doing something wrong that caused their problem instead of assuming they did everything correctly so the problem must be due to the system/developers. The reason this is so much easier is because it helps bridge the communication gap when the newbie describes in detail what the did and what their system is like and what the problem is. Sometimes they did nothing wrong but when that information is withheld or only given begrudgingly it is much more difficult for that to be determined and for the problem to be fixed. When I seem to be the only one with a problem I keep asking myself: what did I do differently? ... what did I do differently?

This is actually a common problem when people who are experts in Windows switch to Linux. I've said it before and I will say it again. This is basically a communication problem and it can be extremely frustrating for everyone involved. The solution is for the newcomer to learn the Linux "language". To do it the other way around would be like an American visiting France and insisting everyone there learn English. But here the problem is worse because the Windows "language" does not apply to Linux. You seem to be fed up with the Windows language. Many/most of us are fed up with it too. I realize it is difficult and painful to learn a new language, but if you stick with it (with us or another distro), you will become fluent and things will become much easier for you. This won't happen in a day or a week. The most valuable thing a newcomer can do is learn how to provide good bug reports. This makes all the difference.

George Bernard Shaw once said: England and America are two countries divided by a common language. The same problem exists for Windows and Linux. We are using the same words and talking about similar things but we are often not communicating. One primary difference is that Linux is built around the command line while Windows is built around the GUI. There is a wonderful short book written by Neal Stephenson called In the Beginning was the Command Line which was written and put online in 1999. I was teaching programming and Linux at a University back then and I made it a reading assignment for my Linux classes. It is almost 20 years old so parts are dated but overall it is still valid. It is basically talking about the Windows language versus the Linux language. I think it is a wonderful, witty way to ease the transition from Windows to Linux.
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself -- and you are the easiest person to fool."

-- Richard Feynman

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richb
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#9 Post by richb »

+1 BitJam. A very insightful and useful post, even for those of us who have been using Linux for years.
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asqwerth
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Re: Issues from Imbedding VBox GA in the Host OS

#10 Post by asqwerth »

BitJam wrote:...Everyone else uses the MX package installer (I think).
Nowadays I do. But previously I didn't even know MXPI had automated the process.

So while using either MX14 or 15 I manually enabled the Oracle Virtualbox repo in Synaptic since that source does show up in Settings>>Repositories.

I had to sort out the gpg keys, refresh Synaptic and then install VB from there, and then add myself to the vboxusers group (easily done from User Manager in MX Tools).

That also works. Did something similar for Neon and Korora by adding the appropriate VB repo to my system and installing from there.

I have never used Gdebi to install VB.

VB gets lots of updates and so to me it's more practical to add the VB repo to the system and get updates directly from the package manager. I suspect if one does manual one-off installations of a .deb file, it's very easy for the installed VB host to become outdated unless the user regularly downloads a new deb file to install.
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