Distrowatch and Init

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Stevo
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#11 Post by Stevo »

Just more of this, IMO:

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asqwerth
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#12 Post by asqwerth »

The DW criticism about being under the radar is from just one person, innit? (get it?! Heh)

I like the fact that MX uses sysvinit, doesn't toot its horn about it, yet has quietly moved into 3rd place and garnered good reviews.

Shows the continued viability of sysvinit in creating a quality distro, and that even users who don't care about the init issue or don't even know MX is not using systemd, like it so much.

To me, that is vindication of sysvinit's relevance in "modern" distros and that it is not just the anti systemd crowd who are attracted to MX.

Make no mistake, I like that MX is not using systemd as init. I think it's important for devs of other software to see that there are non-techy distros that don't use systemd and the devs should thus not include unnecessary systemd dependencies by default.

Even though I also use systemd distros, i wouldn't want that to be a monopoly because I don't like its ever spreading (and unnecessary) encroachment into non init tasks.

There have also recently been various systemd bugs popping up in rolling distros like manjaro.
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paulfsams
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#13 Post by paulfsams »

As someone who knows "just enough to be dangerous," I was convinced that nothing could out do Debian Stable. I was using the MX Repo for more up to date versions of firefox. Since I have started using MX Linux full time, like Debian Stretch, MX Linux "just works." It feels more responsive than Stretch. I don't know if it is my imagination, but, it feels more responsive. The main beef I have with systemd, is when I was shutting down, and it would take one and a half minutes or more. I would follow the suggestions to change systemd settings, and it work; mostly. Like I said, I know just enough to be dangerous. I try to remember that when I start to comment. :happy:

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KBD
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#14 Post by KBD »

I wish Debian had left systemd alone instead of adopting it. If MX can straddle the fence I'm OK with that. I do have concerns it will be harder to do as time goes on, and I've seen a few issues by not having it. But I've also seen systemd slow down boot up with crazy processes. Like I said--really wish Debian had not used it.

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Richard
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#15 Post by Richard »

@KBD,
Actually, I was looking for an "MX type distro" to appear after Debian drank the kool-aid.
I tried quite a few before I found MX first public trials.

I would probably have still been running Debian testing and doing upgrades on Friday afternoons
to have the weekend to recover in case something broke.
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KBD
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#16 Post by KBD »

Richard wrote: Fri Dec 28, 2018 11:00 pm @KBD,
Actually, I was looking for an "MX type distro" to appear after Debian drank the kool-aid.
I tried quite a few before I found MX first public trials.

I would probably have still been running Debian testing and doing upgrades on Friday afternoons
to have the weekend to recover in case something broke.
On some of my systems the move to systemd caused really slow boot times. It is still shocking how quickly Debian jumped on that ship. I wish they did not always follow Red Hat's lead.

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timkb4cq
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#17 Post by timkb4cq »

To be fair, sysvinit was not being maintained when Debian made their decision. I'm pretty sure that was the deciding factor for a lot of the voters. Debian has never liked keeping moribund packages around if they didn't need to.
Not that I agreed with their decision, but I do understand it.

Since then Jesse Smith has taken over sysvinit maintenance and appears to be doing a good job with it.
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mystic
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#18 Post by mystic »

Am not a developer or an IT person, just a regular everyday ex-windows user that uses MX for privacy reasons. My understanding is that the systemd code base is so huge that it even crossed 1 million lines of codes as of late 2017 and has never had a security audit.
That's the reason people promote other inits.
Its a similar reason why Wireguard is becoming more popular over openvpn because of its smaller code base.

Its a security and privacy nightmare in my opinion.
Last edited by mystic on Sat Dec 29, 2018 11:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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BitJam
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Re: Distrowatch and Init

#19 Post by BitJam »

Linux distros that dont't run systemd are very trendy right now:
dw-trending.png
Five of the top six spots and seven of the top nine. Not bad.

Perhaps the critic on DW got it backward. A few years ago people (on Slashdot at least) were bemoaning the fact that all leading distros were using systemd. We've made a leading distro that uses sysvinit and we don't feel the need to boast about it. This means it is not a novelty.
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