Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

Message
Author
User avatar
Jerry3904
Administrator
Posts: 21881
Joined: Wed Jul 19, 2006 6:13 am

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#11 Post by Jerry3904 »

not sure how much more work that would entail
a whole lot...
Production: 5.10, MX-23 Xfce, AMD FX-4130 Quad-Core, GeForce GT 630/PCIe/SSE2, 16 GB, SSD 120 GB, Data 1TB
Personal: Lenovo X1 Carbon with MX-23 Fluxbox and Windows 10
Other: Raspberry Pi 5 with MX-23 Xfce Raspberry Pi Respin

User avatar
anticapitalista
Developer
Posts: 4160
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 10:40 am

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#12 Post by anticapitalista »

rasat wrote: Mon May 06, 2019 11:18 am Same as KBD. I hope MX can keep both sysvinit and systemd in same iso. Not only for user choice, but also as security option. There are/were cases when either one fails during booting. In my case with earlier kernel version running in Dell inspiron 5567.
KBD wrote: Mon May 06, 2019 11:38 am If it turns out to be impossible to use the shim in Buster, I'd suggest either detailed instructions in the wiki for installing systemd on the next MX based on Buster, or, if possible, an option in MX Tools to run a script that installs systemd for users that need it.
Edit: I'd suggest two ISO options for the next Buster-based MX, one for sysVinit, one for systemd, but not sure how much more work that would entail.
It IS impossible (at the moment)
anticapitalista
Reg. linux user #395339.

Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

antiX with runit - lean and mean.
https://antixlinux.com

User avatar
uncle mark
Posts: 787
Joined: Sat Nov 11, 2006 10:42 pm

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#13 Post by uncle mark »

Sometimes in life -- and in Linux -- you just don't have a choice. systemd is what is being adopted going forward throughout Linuxdom. Sure, niche distros will stick to their never-systemd guns, but they will remain niche distros. Unless a solution can be found that can be maintained for the long term, now may be the time to relent and move on.
Custom build Asus/AMD/nVidia circa 2011 -- MX 19.2 KDE
Acer Aspire 5250 -- MX 21 KDE
Toshiba Satellite C55 -- MX 18.3 Xfce
Assorted Junk -- assorted Linuxes

User avatar
baldyeti
Posts: 678
Joined: Sat Dec 05, 2009 4:37 pm

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#14 Post by baldyeti »

Is it worth it for MX to sponsor or take over systemd-shim maintenance ? How many debian subsystems/services will ship with properly tested (sysV)init scripts going forward ?

What are the implications of switching to systemd for antiX and MX (i seem to recall this may break the live features ?) Would it be more work to port the antiX live system to systemd ?

Sorry, i only have questions, probably like most users. Either way i am afraid there is going to be extra work for the developers to support buster.
Last edited by baldyeti on Mon May 06, 2019 1:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
Jan K.
Posts: 32
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2019 8:52 am

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#15 Post by Jan K. »

systemD is definitely not something I want to see between me and the kernel... :bagoverhead:

And really wish MX Linux would stop supporting it... not to debate, just delivering my opinion. :biggrin:

User avatar
KBD
Posts: 959
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 7:52 pm

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#16 Post by KBD »

Jerry3904 wrote: Mon May 06, 2019 11:56 am
not sure how much more work that would entail
a whole lot...
That's what I figured, so didn't mention it as a first option.

User avatar
timkb4cq
Developer
Posts: 3186
Joined: Wed Jul 12, 2006 4:05 pm

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#17 Post by timkb4cq »

baldyeti wrote: Mon May 06, 2019 12:49 pm Is it worth it for MX to sponsor or take over systemd-shim maintenance ? How many debian subsystems/services will ship with properly tested (sysV)init scripts going forward ?
The systemd devs have already broken systemd-shim, are likely to break it again if development is resumed (since they really want systemd at PID 1) and we don't have the developers familiar enough with the internals of systemd to do that development ourselves.

Using systemd-shim doesn't help with init scripts. We would still have to deal with that issue either way.
HP Pavillion TP01, AMD Ryzen 3 5300G (quad core), Crucial 500GB SSD, Toshiba 6TB 7200rpm
Dell Inspiron 15, AMD Ryzen 7 2700u (quad core). Sabrent 500GB nvme, Seagate 1TB

User avatar
ChrisUK
Qualified MX Guide
Posts: 299
Joined: Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:04 pm

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#18 Post by ChrisUK »

Apart from a few active forum users (including devs), I doubt many of the 1000s of MX Linux users even know what systemd is, let alone have the knowledge to argue for it's inclusion/exclusion etc. So, I'll trust the Antix/MX team to do whatever they need to do to maintain the level of stability/reliability (and a few more ***ity's, security/simplicity/usability... etc ;) ), that keeps many, including myself, using both Distros (bearing in mind any restrictions forced upon Antix/MX by decisions made by Debian).

So, as The Four Tops once sang; "Do what you gotta do..." (Yes, I'm that old that I remember The Four Tops ;) )
Chris

MX 18 MX 19 - Manjaro

User avatar
dreamer
Posts: 738
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2017 11:34 am

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#19 Post by dreamer »

Fork Debian Stretch and become independent, smaller (number of packages) and rolling (you already are sort of). If PCLOS can do it... :footinmouth:

PS I don't know what is right for MX Linux so I just throw suggestions at the wall... :puppy:

User avatar
manyroads
Posts: 2603
Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2018 6:33 pm

Re: Just saw dolphin's blog post on systemd-shim

#20 Post by manyroads »

In one of my more unpopular posts/ questions here I asked if it wouldn't make sense to build future releases off of Devuan, rather than Debian, if staying systemd-free was essential. I'll repeat the question, put on my helmet & flak jacket and duck for cover. :eek: :anispider2:

Edit: Or perhaps offer two flavors of MX (Devuan and Debian) thus leaving the systemd non-systemd efforts to the respective root OS team(s).
Pax vobiscum,
Mark Rabideau - ManyRoads Genealogy -or- eirenicon llc. (geeky stuff)
i3wm, bspwm, hlwm, dwm, spectrwm ~ Linux #449130
"For every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong." -- H. L. Mencken

Locked

Return to “General”