A view of managing System Maintenance

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fehlix
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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#11 Post by fehlix »

boombaby wrote: Fri Aug 31, 2018 12:54 pm ... the Net about that "update-icon-caches"
@boombaby,
Not sure what problem space you want to discover or to solve here.
In MX Linux the installation or removel process of applcations and/or themes
does cover the automatic regeneration or removel of the corresponding run-time icons-caches.
So you would not find a managment interface for a user, as the system takes care about it on it's own.
If you are linux-tinkerer you mind find some nice cli helper to do further tinkering.
--fehlix
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m_pav
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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#12 Post by m_pav »

@boombaby, the very thing you are looking for was provided for a closed source system where a single entity controlled all and every aspect of what would be presented to their users and by and large, most of all that it did was modify existing registry keys for the single controlling database on which the system was designed to run. This made it relatively easy to construct such a tool, however, only the tiniest portion of windows users ever used the tool and you can be very certain it did nothing to enhance the user base numbers.

Truth be known, most people are happy to keep the standard base look with a minor tweak here or there and leave the system to manage itself. As with any OS, excepting Microsoft because they muscled their way in, a pre-assembled collection of software rises or falls based on what benefits it provides to the user base. To me it's no surprise we've been climbing in popularity because our core developer pool contains people who were present in the days before Ubuntu existed and our point of origin stems back to a single very talented developer who in the early 2000's was at the top of the charts with Mepis. We've attracted new talent since then and they too have been schooled in the arts, so as the polish applied by Shuttleworths millions wears off (another muscle in), those that do what they do well again rise to the position they rightly deserve.

I'd like to think the antiX and MX teamwork will continue to shine for a long time. AntiX for providing the best light distro ever and being the single handed best option for taking a Debian based assembly and making it into whatever you want and MX for attracting those who like a bit more spit and polish usability enhancements built into their ready to go systems.

The best way to fall in love with your system is to get into the nitty gritty and learn how to make the changes yourself. Who knows, maybe your enthusiasm through your learning experience will inspire you to take on a little project of your own, one that leads to such a utility as the one you're seeking. Should that ever happen, I have only one piece of advice, KISS.
Mike P

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boombaby
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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#13 Post by boombaby »


Hello, MX Team...

In my thread there are a few posts which have crossed over each other, so I'll address a couple of them in here simultaneously. To do that I'll probably have to keep remarks fairly brief. (I hate that because then misunderstandings can happen.)

Before I begin - so no-one misunderstands the direction I'm coming from - I love MX. Lurv it! After a lot of searching through distros, I find that MX has got really great potential. As a User, I rate it alongside only a couple of other distros for looks, usability, completeness and performance. (I also like the way it can be applied with or without systemd. For me, without.)


Richb...
#10 Post by richb » Fri Aug 31, 2018 2:25 pm

I was referring to thumbnail cache which I assumed you meant by icon cache.
That's fine. Since my "view" of "O/S" originated from Windows usage I may not consider how my lingo is "read" by Linuxers. Perhaps I'll take a leaf out of Gant's book, and '...think in "MX"...', or (alternatively) just '...use the force...'.

For me, "icons" are the little symbols used all over the software User-space (by the system) whereas the little representations of photos and pictures are little pics (although they appear as icons. How the system manages icons - storage, in particular - is what I am interesting in understanding (at the moment). @clicktician has put me onto some concepts. (Here post#8, if you are interested... http://www.mxlinux.org/forum/viewtopic. ... eea85d4e64 ...and in fehlix's answer, quoted below from his post.)


fehlix...
#11 Post by fehlix » Fri Aug 31, 2018 3:25 pm
boombaby wrote: ↑Fri Aug 31, 2018 12:54 pm
... the Net about that "update-icon-caches"
@boombaby,
Not sure what problem space you want to discover or to solve here.
In MX Linux the installation or removel process of applcations and/or themes
does cover the automatic regeneration or removel of the corresponding run-time icons-caches.
So you would not find a managment interface for a user, as the system takes care about it on it's own.
If you are linux-tinkerer you mind find some nice cli helper to do further tinkering.
fehlix, see, that's why I look. "Run-time" icon-caches? Elsewhere I have learned that icon-caches are created for each theme - and you've indicated they are "run-time". Are they static or adjustable (in some way - link-list maybe)? In Win2K, for instance, there was a single, fixed icon-cache. If it was too small - for ALL the icons - then it crashed. Once I adjusted it - stable again.

As I stated previously (in post #9 ) since I recently made a customized theme in MX (because that appears to be the only way to make the mouse cursor larger) I am now worried about the way the icon-cache works (under the customized theme, which I can't find anyway, alongside the other themes, in the subspace created for it, by the "system"). See?


Now I'd like to address m_pav...
#12 Post by m_pav » Fri Aug 31, 2018 5:33 pm

@boombaby, the very thing you are looking for was provided for a closed source system where a single entity controlled all and every aspect of what would be presented to their users and by and large, most of all that it did was modify existing registry keys for the single controlling database on which the system was designed to run. This made it relatively easy to construct such a tool, however, only the tiniest portion of windows users ever used the tool and you can be very certain it did nothing to enhance the user base numbers.
My experience in Support-work tells me that many Users want to "tinker". For a lot they get themselves in trouble because they tinker till it "tanks", then they call me. And, I'll bet, they call you - like "me" do now.
Truth be known, most people are happy to keep the standard base look with a minor tweak here or there and leave the system to manage itself.
Bit of juxtaposition of the former. There are some people who only want to use their system as a means to an end - to produce docs, send emails, browse, download stuff, etc. I've found that most people want to adjust their system for looks and music etc. A surprising number want more - to adjust "capability" in some way. However, many Users are "scared" they'll break it, and stop themselves (when they really want to). When they are shown how to use their system, they do. Linux is SO complex (and it's GREAT for that) that the User space needs to be NEAT, CLEAN and SIMPLE. THAT'S where I am coming from.
I'd like to think the antiX and MX teamwork will continue to shine for a long time.
Me too. I want them to shine big. Both are great distros. I've seen a couple of distros of good quality fall right out of favour because the support didn't happen. People walk.
...AntiX for providing the best light distro ever and being the single handed best option
Ahh; yes. Antix IS great. Puppy is another. How they did that (originally) and stick it so easily inside a matchbox is a wonder. [I had Barry Kauler as my Lecturer for a short time. Not surprised at what he came up with.] Same with GUI-based Damn Small Linux fitting onto the head of a pin. Truely amazing!
The best way to fall in love with your system is to get into the nitty gritty and learn how to make the changes yourself.
Disagree. That approach can be good (even brilliant) for some. For others, they may tear their hair out trying to find answers. (I figure I've lost enough hair.) Anyway, what is "support" for, if they constantly rule a line under your effort, and give you the cold shoulder. (Seen that too.) Bet you have too.
Should that ever happen, I have only one piece of advice, KISS.
By "KISS" i "assume" you mean "Keep It Simple, Sweetheart"? Because if you mean the "other" then that's a problem. I wouldn't be feelin' the lurv.



Now, if there was a System Utility that I could go to, to adjust System "stuff" (within proper, restricted, technical limits) then I don't need to bother you about this. [That comment is not meant to be a flame just so you can come back to attack me because you feel I'm attacking you. I'm not. It's just a (thought-provoking) comment.] Yes; I know about all the places I can do stuff, as ChrisUK and chrispop99 mentioned here.... http://www.mxlinux.org/forum/viewtopic. ... eea85d4e64 ...but that's not an "integrated" "thing". It's messy. It's confusing. It misses out on some worthwhile targets. [Again; not a flame, a (thought-provoking) comment.]


Anyway. Sorry to have kept this so brief about such matters, but I hope you get my drift.

Regards,

boombaby
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m_pav
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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#14 Post by m_pav »

Yeah, I did wonder how that KISS would be taken and hoping the tone of my response would lean more towards the sweetheart as it was certainly not intended in the negative. The comment about falling in love was intended for you, not the world at large. Usually, passion such as yours provides the catalyst to start a project and see it through to fruition and where better to start than here where you can be schooled by the right people.

Linux as a movement has way too many variants for a one-solution fits all, so the answer to your plea is within your own abilities, should you take on the challenge to make a start.
Mike P

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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#15 Post by oops »

Maybe you can also try Woogaloo ?
woogaloo (beta): GUI for performing hodgepodge system tasks
viewtopic.php?f=108&t=44861&sid=91e86be ... 4e33290cb7
Pour les nouveaux utilisateurs: Alt+F1 pour le manuel, ou FAQS, MX MANUEL, et Conseils Debian - Info. système “quick-system-info-mx” (QSI) ... Ici: System: MX-19_x64 & antiX19_x32

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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#16 Post by Richard »

Problem is that Woogaloo is not easy to find. (except in that forum reference)
For a while it was in MX Tools, but presently it isn't.
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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#17 Post by boombaby »


Hello, oops and Richard...

Thanks for that guide. "Woogaloo" looks like the kind of software I am talking about. Yes; it would have been nice to find in the Control Centre (MX Tools) I suppose. (A totally integrated thing would be better. However I realise it is "beta".)

Just a note, wherever possible, I try to never use something with a "0.xxxx" prefix - even from Synaptic. "Beta" is a no-no.

This system is a working system (in the main) and I cannot afford to really bork it at the moment. (Sometime soon I am hoping to set up a little better, with an olde additional system, perhaps two.)

I note in the link the mention of the "compatibility" thing with the Kernel.

What do you guys think of the program - worthy or way too risky?


boombaby
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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#18 Post by oops »

boombaby wrote: Sat Sep 01, 2018 10:19 am ...
What do you guys think of the program - worthy or way too risky?
FI: I have already used it (mostly as one shot, for some performance settings, swappiness, cache pressure) ... but a beta version still a beta version (a risque remains).

https://github.com/antix-skidoo/woogalo ... .1_all.deb
/woogaloo_0.1.1_all.deb , look now like that:
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Pour les nouveaux utilisateurs: Alt+F1 pour le manuel, ou FAQS, MX MANUEL, et Conseils Debian - Info. système “quick-system-info-mx” (QSI) ... Ici: System: MX-19_x64 & antiX19_x32

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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#19 Post by Richard »

@oops,
Thanks for the link.
It must have placed itself in MX Tools when I first tested it.
Since then, I've reinstalled to fix some things I broke and just noticed that woogaloo isn't there anymore.
I'll put it back in.

Some of it's entries are still stubs but mostly it works as expected.
Thinkpad T430 & Dell Latitude E7450, both with MX-21.3.1
kernal 5.10.0-26-amd64 x86_64; Xfce-4.18.0; 8 GB RAM
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Re: A view of managing System Maintenance

#20 Post by boombaby »


Hello again...

I am just "thought-streaming" ("mind-surfing?) at the moment so don't hold any of this as firm or, even, understood.

If you have read about my concerns managing "stuff" (and if you noticed that it connects to a "freeze" problem I have talked about it another thread) then you might guide me a little to understand any connection to icon-cache (icon-caching) and the following story off Distrowatch.

It starts here... ... https://distrowatch.com/weekly.php?issue=20180903#news

...in the Miscellaneous section (of Issue#779) starting with... "Canonical, the company behind..."

In there you'll notice it finishes with...
"So this commit selects just a few areas where caching has been verified to be beneficial, and many use cases now see their CPU usage halved."
In there, see the link... ... https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-sh ... equests/73

Number one, I do not want to understand all of that detail. Couldn't.

Two, and what I would like to know is, is that discussion of "caching" talking about the same kinds of "cache" we mentioned? For graphics elements, like icons?

It seems they are talking about problems with "caching all over the place" as opposed to some "universal" style cache (whether that is the same cache we discussed, or associated/linked with the kind of cache we discussed).

Three? In Linux are such caches created "at will", and "wherever"?

(I see this more as minor, side discussion - for reference. Not hard-core.)

Regards,
boombaby
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