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Debian Buster release today!

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manyroads
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#21

Post by manyroads » Sun Jul 07, 2019 8:48 am

dreamer wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:54 pm
manyroads wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:42 pm
KBD wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:39 pm


That Calamares installer on live images should end the complaints of Debian being too hard to install :) I've used that installer in the past and it's quite good and simple to use.
Hopefully as good as it is on Sparky, Manjaro and others...
When I used it with Maui Linux I couldn't install GRUB to partition instead of MBR, but maybe that option is there now.
In the graphical install from the base ISO (not the Live Desktop), there is no evidence of Calamares being used. Unless they re-wrote Calamres to look like the old Debian install. :popcorn: btw. My first totally vanilla install has failed in VBox. Total crash. Yep Buster is looking really good.

Edit: The LiveCD (XFCE) offers the Calamares Installer. I'll see if it works. :p :eek:
Edit#2: Calamares worked fine. I have Debian10-xfce operational in VBox.
Last edited by manyroads on Sun Jul 07, 2019 10:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
Pax vobiscum,
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Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#22

Post by Head_on_a_Stick » Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:24 am

KBD wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:18 pm
I do hope there is some possibility of integrating the secure boot feature of Buster into MX.
Secure Boot support needs the shim-signed package along with the signed kernels that Debian now provide.

Whether the developers want to include packages signed by Microsoft is another question entirely, I have noticed Stevo taking a few swipes at Ubuntu for paying M$ for their keys...
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fehlix
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#23

Post by fehlix » Sun Jul 07, 2019 1:48 pm

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:24 am
KBD wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:18 pm
I do hope there is some possibility of integrating the secure boot feature of Buster into MX.
Secure Boot support needs the shim-signed package along with the signed kernels that Debian now provide.
The point is, that any dkms-packages, e.g. non signed modules like Nvidia, Virtual box etc or other would not be loaded by Debians signed kernel, when booted with secure boot enabled . So the issue is not to have a debian signend kernel setup, so you can boot MX Linux with a secure boot UEFI, but we would need also to get all needed modules to be get signed by debian. Or alternatively just use only what debian does provide as signed modules, which I guess might be limited.
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Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#24

Post by Head_on_a_Stick » Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:11 pm

fehlix wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 1:48 pm
we would need also to get all needed modules to be get signed by debian
I don't think Debian would do that, non-free kernel modules violate their Social Contract.

Why not use Ubuntu's method:

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UEFI/SecureBoot/DKMS

The update-secureboot-policy command and the mmx64.efi MOK manager program can be found in the shim-signed-common and shim-unsigned packages, respectively. The kmodsign command isn't available in the Debian sbsigntool package for some reason so you would have to port over the Ubuntu version instead.
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uncle mark
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#25

Post by uncle mark » Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:14 pm

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 9:24 am
Secure Boot support needs the shim-signed package along with the signed kernels that Debian now provide.

Whether the developers want to include packages signed by Microsoft is another question entirely, I have noticed Stevo taking a few swipes at Ubuntu for paying M$ for their keys...
(in)Secure Boot is not required to run Windows. Disable it in the EFI and you don't have to worry about paying the MSFT protection money or whether or not your modules will run.
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Head_on_a_Stick
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#26

Post by Head_on_a_Stick » Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:16 pm

uncle mark wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:14 pm
Secure Boot is not required to run Windows
No but it does provide a useful layer of extra protection against rootkits and the like.
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#27

Post by fehlix » Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:18 pm

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:11 pm
fehlix wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 1:48 pm
we would need also to get all needed modules to be get signed by debian
I don't think Debian would do that, non-free kernel modules violate their Social Contract.

Why not use Ubuntu's method:
Yes, there are couple of way to achieve this - and some more. But the question asked, was why we can't simply do what buster now can. And we shall explain to people clearly why that's not going to happen the buster way - just to avoid confusion.
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uncle mark
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#28

Post by uncle mark » Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:27 pm

Head_on_a_Stick wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:16 pm
uncle mark wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:14 pm
Secure Boot is not required to run Windows
No but it does provide a useful layer of extra protection against rootkits and the like.
Technically you are correct. But as far as I'm concerned it's a pretense. The whole idea behind (in)Secure Boot is lockdown/lockout.
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#29

Post by Head_on_a_Stick » Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:31 pm

uncle mark wrote:
Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:27 pm
The whole idea behind (in)Secure Boot is lockdown/lockout.
If that was the case then why are Microsoft happy to sign the Linux kernel and the shim bootloader?

Secure Boot is required because the UEFI standard is so insecure, unfortunately.

Anyway we're getting off topic here, sorry for the diversion.
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Re: Debian Buster release today!

#30

Post by BV206 » Sun Jul 07, 2019 3:36 pm

masterpeace wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 11:12 pm
pardon me for a noobish question

how will this update affect MX in the future ? will we have MX 19 soon ?
There was a thread about this a few months ago that I can't find now. This was before Debian determined the release date of Buster. I think they said if Buster was released this summer then MX 19 would be released in the fall or before the end of the year.
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